imported>Scsbot: edited by robot: archiving November 10

2017-11-14T03:24:20Z

edited by robot: archiving November 10

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= November 10 =

== Edit not showing in watchlist ==

I have made several edits in the last week or so. Two of them have not shown up in my watchlist, like [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Jayne_Mansfield&diff=prev&oldid=809428842 this one]. Yes, the talk page I edited does indicate it is on my watchlist. Anyone? [[User:Moriori|Moriori]] ([[User talk:Moriori|talk]]) 01:17, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
:Different watchlist settings at [[Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-watchlist]] can hide it, e.g. "Hide my edits from the watchlist". I see after enabling "Expand watchlist to show all changes, not just the most recent". If this is disabled then you will never see edits before the most recent, not even if you have a setting which hides the most recent edit, e.g hiding minor edits or bot edits. [[User:PrimeHunter|PrimeHunter]] ([[User talk:PrimeHunter|talk]]) 01:36, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
::"It's weird. Never noticed this before. Checked preferences, and they seem ok. Have not changed prefs for years. Yesterday I made edits at 10:11am, 14:25pm, 14:29pm and 15.00pm. The first and last edits appear in my watchlist but not the two in the middle. Very curious. No matter, it's not an earth shattering glitch. [[User:Moriori|Moriori]] ([[User talk:Moriori|talk]]) 01:53, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
:::The two edits which appear in your description are current and the two which don't appear are not current. This is consistent with "Expand watchlist to show all changes, not just the most recent" being disabled. [[User:PrimeHunter|PrimeHunter]] ([[User talk:PrimeHunter|talk]]) 02:17, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
::::If it's enabled and you prefer that then try temporarily disabling it, saving preferences, enabling it and saving again. [[User:PrimeHunter|PrimeHunter]] ([[User talk:PrimeHunter|talk]]) 02:20, 10 November 2017 (UTC)

== Editing broken math template Intorient ==
I recently started using the Wikipedia app in dark mode and recently notices that the {{tl|Intorient}} does not correctly display in a white print with a black background to match and instead displays in a black print surrondes by a white box which clips with other text. How would I go about fixing this problem? The reason that I am not asking this question here instead of at [[Template talk:Intorient]] is because the talk page has only one question that is almost 2 years old. Sorry if my question is poorly formatted as I am asking it from my phone. [[User:The Editor's Apprentice|The Editor's Apprentice]] ([[User talk:The Editor's Apprentice|talk]]) 03:46, 10 November 2017 (UTC)

:I have moved your message to the foot of the page, as that is where new messages go. I have also reformatted so that it links to the template, rather than transcluding it. --[[User:David Biddulph|David Biddulph]] ([[User talk:David Biddulph|talk]]) 04:09, 10 November 2017 (UTC)

== What link to use for a citation? ==

I'm trying to fix some [[link rot]] in our article [[Cohong]], specifically the second reference to a PDF file with the title "論清代行商制度與貿易發展的關係". Googling for that title finds the PDF file (second result), which I can download to my computer. But I need the link for the article, and unfortunately Google gives it a cumbersome URL with tons of attribute-value pairs, which is not an appropriate replacement for the rotten link. One of the attribute-value pairs is "url=http%3A%2F%2Fishare.down.sina.com.cn%2F19279525.pdf" but unfortunately the URL "http://ishare.down.sina.com.cn/19279525.pdf" gives a 403 error. I tried a couple of other search engines, but none seems to find the same PDF. So my question is: What should I use as the replacement for the rotten link? — [[User:SebastianHelm|Sebastian]] 08:14, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
:Hello {{u|SebastianHelm}}, I don't know if you're looking for this, but perhaps the following link might be useful: <nowiki>http://ishare.down.sina.com.cn/19279525.pdf?ssig=oVWe2GhRtH&Expires=1514430533&KID=sina,ishare&ip=&fn=论清代行商制度与贸易发展的关系.pdf</nowiki> Thanks, '''[[User talk:Lourdes|Lourdes]]''' 10:33, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
*{{re|SebastianHelm}} Looks like Lourdes beat me to the answer. This being said, that link will probably rot fast. If we assume that the {{code|Expires}} key in the URL describes a timestamp past which the file will no longer be accessible, and that is a time in seconds after the [[Unix epoch]], [https://duckduckgo.com/?q=unix+time+1514430533&ia=answer DuckDuckGo tells me] that the date is December 28, 2017, meaning the link will expire in a month and a half. OK, that's free speculation on my part, but it does not look unrealistic either; the {{code|ishare.down.sina.com}} domain is probably a file sharing service of some sort. [[User:Tigraan|Tigraan]][[User talk:Tigraan|Click here to contact me]] 10:47, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
:: Thank you, guys. Unfortunately, at least as of now, that URL gives me the same 403 error. If it worked for you when you posted it, then it seems to be even less durable. — [[User:SebastianHelm|Sebastian]] 14:38, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
:It seems to me that a PDF file, whatever its content, cannot possibly be acceptable in a reference unless it is hosted on a reliable site. That surely applies equally to an archived copy of a PDF, {{U|SebastianHelm}}? Another PDF with the same title found by Google on a random sharing site might not even be the same document, and even if it is it could be a different version, or have been altered. --[[User:ColinFine|ColinFine]] ([[User talk:ColinFine|talk]]) 11:56, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
::I disagree. It does not matter that the link is given to {{code|shadysite.com}}, unless there are credible reasons to think it was materially altered (or that the site will soon take down the link, or replace it with malware etc.). Of course, knowing the original publisher/website is important in evaluating whether this is an [[WP:RS]], but the link is merely a convenience, not really part of the reference itself; it can be pointed to a file storage site. For example, it is fairly common to point to academics' university pages where they store a copy of scientific articles they published; the pages are [[WP:SPS]], but the ''reference'' is to the article that went through peer review, not its particular location on the web. [[User:Tigraan|Tigraan]][[User talk:Tigraan|Click here to contact me]] 12:11, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
:::You're right, of course, {{U|Tigraan}}, and it's a point I often make myself. I missed that this reference has a title, author and publisher (though no date), so in principle could be obtainable other than by the link. --[[User:ColinFine|ColinFine]] ([[User talk:ColinFine|talk]]) 12:24, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
:::: Might it be an option to host such a document on Commons, subject to the right CC permission, of course? — [[User:SebastianHelm|Sebastian]] 14:38, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
:::::It is an option only if a (correct) CC license applies, which is unlikely. If the ref details are correct in the Cohong article, it was published by the [[Chinese Culture University]], a private university in Taiwan, which likely retains copyright of some sort. Contrary to the belief of some people (which may or not include you), merely posting something on the internet for anyone to see free of charge does not make it public domain or freely-licensed in any way. Maybe the document is marked as CC or public domain, but I doubt it (I cannot read Chinese). [[User:Tigraan|Tigraan]][[User talk:Tigraan|Click here to contact me]] 14:55, 10 November 2017 (UTC)

== Draft:John Wadham (died 1412) ==

Hello,

I contributed, initially anonymously, to the above Draft:John Wadham (died 1412) a medieval Justice of the Common Pleas,
and have only now joined Wikipedia.
Can you please tell me, since I am inexperienced, how does the completed Draft now move on to the next stage of becoming a published article ? It has been seemingly stuck at the Draft stage for some months now.
I would be happy for anyone competent to do this for me.

With best wishes,

Even-tables — Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Even-tables|Even-tables]] ([[User talk:Even-tables#top|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Even-tables|contribs]]) 11:31, 10 November 2017 (UTC) 

:Hello, {{U|Even-tables}}. I have added a template to the draft, with a button to submit it for review. (Putting it for review is not mandatory: somebody could just [[WP:move|move]] the draft to main space, but I would recommend it for drafts by inexperienced editors). On a quick look, it looks a reasonable draft; but the citations could have more bibliographic detail: see [[WP:referencing for beginners|referencing for beginners]]. Since there isn't another article on a John Wadham, the "died 1412" is not required in the title, (we only use such phrases when it is necessary to distinguish articles) but that will get sorted out by the reviewer who accepts the draft. --[[User:ColinFine|ColinFine]] ([[User talk:ColinFine|talk]]) 12:18, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
*{{ec}} {{re|Even-tables}} What ColinFine said. I took the liberty of moving your draft to [[Draft:John Wadham]] already.
:In the future, sign your posts by typing four tildes (<code><nowiki>~~~~</nowiki></code>) at the end, it will generate a signature+timestamp for you. [[User:Tigraan|Tigraan]][[User talk:Tigraan|Click here to contact me]] 12:20, 10 November 2017 (UTC)

== [[Megan Alatini]] ==

Please, remove this article. — Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Jimharrison1809|Jimharrison1809]] ([[User talk:Jimharrison1809#top|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Jimharrison1809|contribs]]) 12:45, 10 November 2017 (UTC) 
:{{ping|Jimharrison1809}} Please explain why? In the meantime, it seems a recent bot edit left a copy-out tag <nowiki>(— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/79.224.45.197|79.224.45.197]] ([[User talk:79.224.45.197#top|talk]]) 23:05, 10 November 2017 (UTC) 
:Why? --[[User:Orangemike|Orange Mike]] | [[User talk:Orangemike|Talk]] 00:55, 11 November 2017 (UTC)
:[edit conflict] It isn't on Wikipedia. It's on [[Wikimedia Commons]], a related website whose photos can automatically be used here. To request its deletion, please go to [[:c:File:Jill Asemota.jpg|the file]] and click the "Nominate for deletion" button at the bottom of the left-side menu; this will start a deletion discussion. Please remember to provide a good reason why the file must be deleted, because nominations with poor reasons will be rejected by other people who participate in the discussion, and nominations with no reasons whatsoever will be closed immediately. By the way, the image had been inappropriately [[C:COM:OVERWRITE|overwritten]], so I've split it into two separate files. When you left this note, the image you saw was the one now appearing at [[:c:File:Jill Asemota, hand on hip.jpg]], so probably you ought to go there for the deletion nomination. [[User:Nyttend|Nyttend]] ([[User talk:Nyttend|talk]]) 00:58, 11 November 2017 (UTC)

MyWiki:Help desk/Archives/2017 November 10 - Revision history

imported>Scsbot: edited by robot: archiving November 10